<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #1514</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	12/17/99 1:28:37 AM Pacific Standard Time<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Friday, December 17 1999     Volume 1999 : Number 1514<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait)<BR>
Re: Ethnic Confusions (was: Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait))<BR>
Re: chicks with guns, and 3I porno<BR>
Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait)<BR>
silly traveller <BR>
silly traveller <BR>
Silly Traveller (the best kind!)<BR>
Re: chicks with guns, and 3I porno<BR>
Re: Ethnic Confusions (was: Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait))<BR>
Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait)<BR>
[none]<BR>
Re Canon<BR>
Re: chicks with guns, and 3I porno<BR>
Re: OT Suggestions<BR>
Re: Silly Traveller<BR>
Re: racial make-up<BR>
Re: technology advances<BR>
Re: independent Terran invention of jump drive? sure<BR>
Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait)<BR>
re:  Grunts and their food<BR>
Re: Silly Traveller<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 22:52:44 -0800<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait)<BR>
<BR>
>From: Robert Prior <robert_prior@sympatico.ca><BR>
>Subject: Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait)<BR>
...<BR>
>Further reading: Richardson's "Statistics of Deadly Quarrels"; <BR>
<BR>
  I skimmed that at someone's insistence, and couldn't be bothered<BR>
to continue. I later saw it referred to as "mathematical (or was it <BR>
strategic?) science-fiction", so I've not felt too shorted by the<BR>
decision. Being able to pick out most of the authors background and<BR>
start to guess at his biases with in a paragraph or three might also<BR>
have been a tip-off..<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 22:49:45 -0800<BR>
From: "Kiri Aradia Morgan" <tiamat@tsoft.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Ethnic Confusions (was: Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait))<BR>
<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
>><BR>
>> From: Kyle Schuant <kyle3054@yahoo.com><BR>
>><BR>
>>> I'm always confused by caucasians' inability to tell one asian race from<BR>
another: usually, I get it about right (though some chinese look korean).<BR>
What's more, they think it makes no difference.<BR>
>>><BR>
A large part of the reason it is important to know is that the various Asian<BR>
and African ethnic groups hate each other a lot more than the various White<BR>
ethnic groups *usually* do, sometimes for reasons that are historical and<BR>
other times for reasons that are downright mysterious-- I've NEVER<BR>
understood why the Chinese so look down upon the East Indians, for example,<BR>
although I understand real well why most other Asians dislike the Japanese.<BR>
<BR>
>> Once a friend of mine at school, a Korean, was asked if she was Chinese<BR>
by another friend of mine at school (who incidentally isn't caucasian, but<BR>
that's beside the point). On the way to class, she complained about the<BR>
inability of people to differentiate Koreans from Chinese.<BR>
>><BR>
That's funny.  I think that Koreans look a lot more like the Japanese than<BR>
like the Chinese, but don't tell that to either a Korean or a Japanese.  The<BR>
languages are closely related, too.<BR>
<BR>
>> After she was finished, I asked her what ethnic group I was from, and she<BR>
was stumped, and she got the point. Personally, I get people who have<BR>
confused me for Irish, German, English, and a host of others.<BR>
>><BR>
But Chris, generally, if a white person is fairly ethnically unmixed, I<BR>
usually CAN tell.  French and Germans are very easy to tell apart, usually.<BR>
<BR>
>Ahh, that's nothing!  My ethnogenetic background is a mix of Scotch-Irish,<BR>
German, and Filipino, giving me olive skin, light brown eyes, and curly<BR>
brown hair.  I've had people assume that I speak Spanish, and other people<BR>
ask me what my plans were for Passover.  I have that generic Mediterranean<BR>
look, I guess, yet none of my known ancestors are from the Mediterranean<BR>
region.<BR>
><BR>
LOL, same here.<BR>
<BR>
I was not raised by my biological parents, and my adoptive parents were<BR>
fairly white bread types-- I don't look a thing like them.  What we know of<BR>
my biological parents is this:  my mother was Irish, and I do mean IRISH,<BR>
first or second generation, whereas my father was at least half Asian,<BR>
though he may have had some other type of ancestry.  It is not certain if he<BR>
was actually Japanese, but that's what people believed.  This is all gleaned<BR>
from various rumors and things that my adoptive mother says when she is<BR>
snockered; she knew and detested my biological mother, though she denies<BR>
this when sober.<BR>
<BR>
I have VERY white skin and black-brown eyes; when you cover the lower half<BR>
of my face people instantly think I am at least half Asian, but cover the<BR>
top half of my face and they invariably guess Irish.  (My hair has been lots<BR>
of colors.  It is currently black with deep brown highlights; it was black<BR>
when I was born, lightened to brown in middle childhood, turned dark red<BR>
very briefly in my late teens, and started to go grey on my 21st birthday.<BR>
It is, however, unrelievably straight, laughs at curling irons, and has to<BR>
be permed to hold a curl longer than 20 minutes unless there is a lot of<BR>
humidity or I spray it with this Japanese "hair styling water" that is the<BR>
only thing on earth that will hold it in place.  Aqua Net also works, but<BR>
Hiroshi smokes so that's a bad idea...)<BR>
<BR>
Asians frequently recognize that I am part Asian, and when I was in Japan,<BR>
where I felt very much at home, I could sometimes pass for a half-Japanese<BR>
or even for a Japanese if I didn't look people straight in the eyes.  I look<BR>
very much like the children of a white friend in Saitama who is married to a<BR>
Japanese man-- so much so that she has often been annoyed by being asked if<BR>
she is my mother, because I do not look my age and I treat her girls like<BR>
little sisters.  (I don't have kids of my own, and wouldn't know how to be a<BR>
mom if I had to.)<BR>
<BR>
The funniest reaction I've ever gotten was from the editor of Giant Robot,<BR>
when I was still married to His Satanic Majesty.  Eric saw me sign my name<BR>
and said:  "Kiri Ho-- Japanese first name, Chinese last name, which one of<BR>
your parents was white?"<BR>
<BR>
But here, living in California, I have had little old ladies walk past three<BR>
or four legitimate Latina girls to earnestly and insistently question me in<BR>
Spanish and refuse adamantly to believe that I can't understand them.<BR>
<BR>
I've learned that the only way to get rid of them is to say, insistently,<BR>
"Supeingo ga wakarimasen yo, obaasan!" over and over and over.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
My stepsister's Arab boyfriends used to chase me and when I was in Greece,<BR>
people assumed I was a native, as well.<BR>
<BR>
Most funny of all were the restaurant experiences I routinely had with my<BR>
Chinese ex-husband.  We would frequently eat Italian food because he had<BR>
lived in Italy, and the Italian waiters would walk up to us and expect me to<BR>
order.  They would blink and stare when he would order in fluent Italian and<BR>
then they would ask me, in Italian, which I don't understand, if I taught<BR>
him.  He would tell them no.  This amused me.<BR>
<BR>
When we went to Japanese restaurants, the reverse always happened.  This<BR>
pissed him off.  He did have kind of a Japanese look to the set of his eyes,<BR>
but he was from Hong Kong and he really hated the Japanese.  He would get<BR>
very annoyed when people reminded him that *I* was most likely part<BR>
Japanese, the same kind of annoyance that Hiroshi sometimes gets when<BR>
Koreans say that I look part Korean, only much more pronounced because Vince<BR>
was serious about his racism.<BR>
<BR>
Kiri  =)<BR>
<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Kiri Aradia Morgan         93!      Thou Art God...<BR>
tiamat@tsoft.com<BR>
<BR>
"That wickedness weltering around inside of you, inside of everyone, is<BR>
sacred somewhere.  There's<BR>
a deity out here who digs it.  You can respect and love your darkest side,<BR>
disposing of only what is obsolete or impractical.  It's all about giving<BR>
yourself permission."<BR>
                                     -- Jack Darkhand<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 23:18:36 -0800<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: chicks with guns, and 3I porno<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
>Subject: Re: chicks with guns, and 3I porno<BR>
...<BR>
>However in the past few years the rate of armed crime in the UK has <BR>
>risen. None of the reports I've seen can say why, but we can all guess <BR>
>what the more radical pro-gunners think.<BR>
<BR>
  Maybe someone in the UK can check this? ISTR reading an article in<BR>
a conservative UK newspaper stating differently, but I can't find the <BR>
reference just now :(<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 23:18:14 -0800<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait)<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 17 Dec 1999 00:19:33 -0500, Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> From: Kyle Schuant <kyle3054@yahoo.com><BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> > I'm always confused by caucasians' inability to tell<BR>
> > one asian race from another: usually, I get it about<BR>
> > right (though some chinese look korean). What's more,<BR>
> > they think it makes no difference.<BR>
> <BR>
> Once a friend of mine at school, a Korean, was asked if she was Chinese by<BR>
> another friend of mine at school (who incidentally isn't caucasian, but<BR>
> that's beside the point). On the way to class, she complained about the<BR>
> inability of people to differentiate Koreans from Chinese.<BR>
> <BR>
> After she was finished, I asked her what ethnic group I was from, and she<BR>
> was stumped, and she got the point. Personally, I get people who have<BR>
> confused me for Irish, German, English, and a host of others.<BR>
<BR>
That's simple: you're a honky!  :)<BR>
<BR>
Funny how many asians might call your non-caucasian friend a racist because<BR>
of their incorrect assessment.  Turn the tables on them (like you did) and<BR>
suddenly it isn't a racial issue anymore.<BR>
<BR>
I can usually tell the difference between Chinese and other asians, and can<BR>
sometimes even get lucky picking a Korean person out of a crowd of asians.<BR>
I have a problem with Vietnamese or some of the other south-east asian<BR>
countries, however.  Don't know why.  Then again, I can't possibly tell the<BR>
difference between people of Russian, British, or French origin.  Don't<BR>
know why...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
James W. Lindsay       Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
"http://members.home.net/jlindsay"   ICQ:7521644 (Sharkey)<BR>
<BR>
"Honk if you've slept with Riker."<BR>
           -- typical Starfleet shuttlecraft bumpersticker<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 23:25:07 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Kyle Schuant <kyle3054@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: silly traveller <BR>
<BR>
> > > "ECM" [Ethically Challenged Merchant] is a<BR>
> euphemism<BR>
> > > for the P-word.<BR>
The Mysterious Wombat Boy wrote:<BR>
> No, the "P-word" is...<BR>
> <BR>
> *looks around, makes sure that nobody else is<BR>
> listening*<BR>
> <BR>
> "Pirate."<BR>
> <BR>
> *quickly ducks and runs*<BR>
<BR>
Now, new career path... runs just like a merchant<BR>
character, only the retirement benefits table goes<BR>
like:<BR>
1. cash<BR>
2. booty (har har, stuff dat ain't cash yet)<BR>
3. parrot<BR>
4. cutlass <BR>
5. annoyingly persistent law enforcement offical who<BR>
you killed their child/parent/spouse/partner once but<BR>
have forgotten it<BR>
6. the Explosive Decompression Long Jump<BR>
<BR>
=====<BR>
KA Schuant<BR>
member: Chef's Guild International, Sporting Shooter's Assoc, Amnesty Int, Carlton Soccer Club<BR>
Melbourne<BR>
Australia<BR>
<BR>
"Duct tape is like the Force: it has a light side, a dark side, and it binds the universe together"<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Thousands of Stores.  Millions of Products.  All in one place.<BR>
Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 23:25:16 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Kyle Schuant <kyle3054@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: silly traveller <BR>
<BR>
> > > "ECM" [Ethically Challenged Merchant] is a<BR>
> euphemism<BR>
> > > for the P-word.<BR>
The Mysterious Wombat Boy wrote:<BR>
> No, the "P-word" is...<BR>
> <BR>
> *looks around, makes sure that nobody else is<BR>
> listening*<BR>
> <BR>
> "Pirate."<BR>
> <BR>
> *quickly ducks and runs*<BR>
<BR>
Now, new career path... runs just like a merchant<BR>
character, only the retirement benefits table goes<BR>
like:<BR>
1. cash<BR>
2. booty (har har, stuff dat ain't cash yet)<BR>
3. parrot<BR>
4. cutlass <BR>
5. annoyingly persistent law enforcement offical who<BR>
you killed their child/parent/spouse/partner once but<BR>
have forgotten it<BR>
6. the Explosive Decompression Long Jump<BR>
<BR>
=====<BR>
KA Schuant<BR>
member: Chef's Guild International, Sporting Shooter's Assoc, Amnesty Int, Carlton Soccer Club<BR>
Melbourne<BR>
Australia<BR>
<BR>
"Duct tape is like the Force: it has a light side, a dark side, and it binds the universe together"<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Thousands of Stores.  Millions of Products.  All in one place.<BR>
Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 23:31:41 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Kyle Schuant <kyle3054@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Silly Traveller (the best kind!)<BR>
<BR>
> Quark.<BR>
> <BR>
> - Hyphen<BR>
> <BR>
Now _that_ was a cool show! I guess when you roll up a<BR>
character and he gets just "admin-6" and "board<BR>
games-6", and just a blade as retirement pay, that was<BR>
where you were posted!<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: are there interstellar garbage scows? How much<BR>
would one cost? Now one of those would make an<BR>
excellent tramp trader, so long as you could persuade<BR>
one of the PCs to wash it out... I think I'll have to<BR>
add that to the freight tables: "garbage, destination,<BR>
nearest sun." <BR>
Or maybe the garbage gets dumped on that prison<BR>
planet? Gives them something to play with.<BR>
<BR>
=====<BR>
KA Schuant<BR>
member: Chef's Guild International, Sporting Shooter's Assoc, Amnesty Int, Carlton Soccer Club<BR>
Melbourne<BR>
Australia<BR>
<BR>
"Duct tape is like the Force: it has a light side, a dark side, and it binds the universe together"<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Thousands of Stores.  Millions of Products.  All in one place.<BR>
Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 23:42:57 -0800<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: chicks with guns, and 3I porno<BR>
<BR>
>From: cos 90 <cos90@powersurfr.com><BR>
>Subject: Re: chicks with guns, and 3I porno<BR>
...<BR>
>By your logic, then, Canada, which has gun-control laws that are<BR>
>stricter than any found in the USA, should have a much higher violent<BR>
>crime rate. We do, in fact, have one that is much *lower*. One<BR>
<BR>
  I'm not sure about that - the one statistic that is striking is that<BR>
our murder rate is about a tenth of theirs, or an annual body count in<BR>
the US of about 90-100x ours (for a population about 8-9x larger - go<BR>
figure?). FWIW, break-ins and muggings are pretty much a barrel of laughs<BR>
compared to being shot and/or killed (I'm guessing about that last, but<BR>
I hope that I'll be forgiven the liberty), so I'll take things as they<BR>
are. And I intend never to spend more than a weekend at a time in the US<BR>
(well, except maybe another cruise to Alaska - way cool stuff).<BR>
<BR>
>factor: the relative lack of availability of guns. Sure, someone who<BR>
>really really wants one can probably get one. But a lot of people who<BR>
>in the US would be able to get one would just give up here, since they<BR>
>aren't as easily available. The cost (in time, effort, and possibly cash)<BR>
>is higher than many would want to pay.<BR>
<BR>
  As much fun as the gun nuts can be, there doesn't seem to be a direct<BR>
correlation between gun possession and murders - witness comparing Calgary <BR>
& Vancouver; Alberta has the highest possession rate of the provinces<BR>
(IIRC), while Vancouver is mostly empty of firearms (regardless of the<BR>
efforts of those heroic entrepreneurs in organized crime). And yet the<BR>
murder rates are comparable at best (Vancouver is the third-largest city<BR>
in the country, but Calgary is close enough for comparison) - at worst<BR>
Vancouver is rather worse (pick your years carefully, and have fun adding<BR>
suspected murders allocated from missing persons tallies).<BR>
<BR>
  I wonder how Vancouver & Seattle stack up historically, though - they<BR>
should be tolerably similar.<BR>
<BR>
        Steven Hudson<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1999 02:48:40 -0500<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Ethnic Confusions (was: Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait))<BR>
<BR>
From: Kiri Aradia Morgan <tiamat@tsoft.com><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> That's funny.  I think that Koreans look a lot more like the Japanese<BR>
>than like the Chinese, but don't tell that to either a Korean or a<BR>
>Japanese.  The languages are closely related, too.<BR>
<BR>
Just repeating what she said. Here in Philly, the dominant Asian grouping<BR>
happens to be Chinese, that probably has something to do with it.<BR>
<BR>
> >> After she was finished, I asked her what ethnic group I was from,<BR>
> >> and she was stumped, and she got the point. Personally, I get<BR>
> >> people who have confused me for Irish, German, English, and a<BR>
> >>host of others.<BR>
<BR>
> But Chris, generally, if a white person is fairly ethnically unmixed, I<BR>
> usually CAN tell.  French and Germans are very easy to tell apart,<BR>
> usually.<BR>
<BR>
The point isn't of the story wasn't whether or not *you* can tell, nor was<BR>
it that it's impossible to tell. The point is that *she* couldn't; it's<BR>
usually extremely difficult to tell various ethnicities apart if you're<BR>
neither exposed to them, nor given any compelling reason to tell them apart<BR>
in the first place. She never had a reason to tell various European<BR>
ethnicities apart, so it never became an issue for her.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1999 03:08:10 -0500<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait)<BR>
<BR>
From: James W. Lindsay <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> That's simple: you're a honky!  :)<BR>
<BR>
Please! I prefer the term ofay. ;)<BR>
<BR>
> Funny how many asians might call your non-caucasian friend a<BR>
>racist because of their incorrect assessment.  Turn the tables on<BR>
>them (like you did) and suddenly it isn't a racial issue anymore.<BR>
<BR>
Well, Kyle had said that he was confused by the inability of caucasians to<BR>
tell the difference between different asian ethnic groups. It's not like<BR>
there are flash cards, or classes which drill the differences between<BR>
varying ethnicities into people's heads.<BR>
<BR>
> countries, however.  Don't know why.  Then again, I can't possibly<BR>
>tell the difference between people of Russian, British, or French<BR>
>origin.  Don't know why...<BR>
<BR>
The only real gaff I ever made was when I called a friend of mine Russian<BR>
after knowing him for several years. He was taken aback and he told me he<BR>
was of Welsh and French descent...<BR>
<BR>
Of course, he looked (and still looks) like slightly less mad Rasputin, he<BR>
speaks fluent Russian, and his father is a Russian-Orthodox priest (and an<BR>
honorary cossack).<BR>
<BR>
So, I feel that I was justified. :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 23:02:15 -0900<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
>HERETIC!!!  HERETIC!!!  HERETIC!!!<BR>
><BR>
>I know.  Just please don't burn me at the stake.<BR>
><BR>
>Kiri  =)<BR>
<biting Sarcasm = on><BR>
Nah, why burn you? I simply want to restart the XTML... I'd rather isolate<BR>
myself from those "Damned GURPSies" and "T4 Weenies"... Not to mention the<BR>
"TNE Geeks, Freaks, and Gearheads".<BR>
<biting Sarcasm Off><BR>
<BR>
Seriously, tho, I'd like to see the XTML back.... And restricted solely to<BR>
CT/MT. (No GT, TNE, T4, T5, etc.)<BR>
<BR>
XTML, more properly X-boat, was killed despite protests of the most active<BR>
posters, because MWM promised us a "Revised CT", and said the only place<BR>
for info was this list, and NOT the XBML; what we got was not anything like<BR>
CT, MT, nor TNE.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
Mailto:aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis mailto:wilh@alaska.com<BR>
ICQ:14640742          AIM:AKAramis	ARM 1.0: 3 R H++ P+<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 22:56:30 -0900<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Canon<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>	Without meaning to throw sparks on the dry tinder of<BR>
>	the canon issue, how many of you follow the official<BR>
>	rules and canon?  I use most of the CT rules that I<BR>
>	know of, and don't sweat the ones I don't know.<BR>
<BR>
I do MT, with certain tweaks. I "adjusted" the task system to att/3, and<BR>
icnreased difficulties by 1. I use the Personal/Vehicular rules for ship<BR>
combat, based upon the tables in the PM. I use Mayday's movement for space<BR>
combat, but tied into the large scale combat rules in Ref's Companion. I<BR>
use the materials in DGP MT modules. (I need to acquire all the rules<BR>
materials prior to issue 15... someone stole issues 12-14 from me...)<BR>
<BR>
As far as canon goes IMTU, I stop with 1115... from there, all bets are<BR>
off. Also, nothing in canon from the start date of a campaign is "fixed",<BR>
ie, PC's may (and often do) make a difference.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
Mailto:aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis mailto:wilh@alaska.com<BR>
ICQ:14640742          AIM:AKAramis	ARM 1.0: 3 R H++ P+<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1999 08:02:33 +0000<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: chicks with guns, and 3I porno<BR>
<BR>
At 1:40 -0500 17/12/99, Sethkimmel@aol.com wrote:<BR>
>BTW, that reminds me. What ever happened to the story of that female newsie<BR>
>who got the back of her head blown off? Did they ever catch the killer?<BR>
<BR>
Nothing yet, They thought  they had the gun, but it was the wrong <BR>
one. If you do a search on the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/) under Jill <BR>
Dando you should find out some more as she was one of their reporters.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
                        MiB - Marines in Battledress<BR>
    "Protecting the Imperium from the Scum of the Galaxy"<BR>
Rob Prior's Mac software @ http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1999 07:57:31 +0000<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT Suggestions<BR>
<BR>
At 21:57 -0500 16/12/99, shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR>
> > First, go get FinderPop. The Mac has much more customizable context menus<BR>
> > (like right clicking in Windows), but you have to press the control key<BR>
> > when you click.<BR>
><BR>
>The things I learn on this list. I must have missed that it the (*old*)<BR>
>manual I have.<BR>
<BR>
I think this was only fully implemented in MacOS >8, and Drag and <BR>
Drop becoming pervasive is System 7 onwards...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
                        MiB - Marines in Battledress<BR>
    "Protecting the Imperium from the Scum of the Galaxy"<BR>
Rob Prior's Mac software @ http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1999 00:38:44 -0800<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Silly Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 12/16/99 8:25 PM, Sethkimmel@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> The Orthodox Cohens and Levites say they do (sort of...), but I'm skeptical.<BR>
<BR>
I would think they would just scratch out the ones they can't verify. Is<BR>
that what you meant by sort of?<BR>
<BR>
> There's been 1800 some odd years of intermarriage and/or rape (one reason<BR>
> Judaism is matrilineal - you always know who the mother is...). As an<BR>
> example, I'm 3/4 German-Austrian and a quarter Italian. If I were a<BR>
> descendent of the last High Priest, logically I should look somewhat like an<BR>
> Arab, and not the pale skinned freckled redhead I am...<BR>
<BR>
Why not? It is quite a stretch, but since it only need to go back along one<BR>
line (mothers) you could have a variety of other races represented on the<BR>
other side.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1999 01:00:17 -0800<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: racial make-up<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 12/16/99 10:40 PM, kyle3054@yahoo.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Seth Kimmel's Ob Trav: will the people of the third<BR>
> Imperium all have light brown<BR>
> skin as a <BR>
> result of the various races interbreeding, or will<BR>
> there still be lots<BR>
> of <BR>
> variation due to custom and the huge size of inhabited<BR>
> space?<BR>
<BR>
I don't care what hand-waving is done to disperse a homogenous humaniti in<BR>
the TU (O or Y), but racial variation IMNSHO would be *greater* in a far<BR>
future intersteller society. And I like variety. OK, so I'm not objective on<BR>
this then. But I don't care. ;)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1982 19:21:30 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: technology advances<BR>
<BR>
> From: Kiri Aradia Morgan <tiamat@tsoft.com><BR>
<BR>
> No, you were supposed to think "drugs".  At either Woodstock or Altamont,<BR>
> can't remember which (I was very very small at the time) there were<BR>
> announcements:  "DO NOT TAKE THE BROWN ACID!!!"  I always wondered what it<BR>
> did.  Hiroshi (my rather significant and definitely other -- a friend once<BR>
> said "men are from Mars, women are from Venus, and Hiroshi is from Omicron<BR>
> Zeta VIII, but we love him" -- probably knows, even though it was before<BR>
> his time too...)<BR>
<BR>
You're showing your age if you're confusing Woodstock and Altamont --<BR>
you're either very young (and don't have memories of the time) or very,<BR>
very old (and forgetting).  Woodstock was the event where the brown acid<BR>
was bad.  Now I'm showing my age -- I don't recall who made the<BR>
announcement (it was one of the performers, in a very famous film clip),<BR>
nor exactly what the brown acid did (it probably made you really sick --<BR>
vomiting and hallucinating at the same time).  <BR>
<BR>
Altamont was the opposite of Woodstock in many ways.  The Rolling Stones<BR>
headlined it and were a very dominant force, unlike the general<BR>
cooperative spirit at Woodstock.  The Stones hired the Hell's Angels for<BR>
security guards.  There was a lot of violence (allegedly started by<BR>
drunken Hell's Angels, apparently taking their cue from the Chicago<BR>
police), and many audience members were seriously injured.  Woodstock<BR>
had a lot of problems, too, but nothing like that, and is generally<BR>
regarded as one of the high points of the 1960s era in America -- while<BR>
Altamont was a real downer.  <BR>
<BR>
Anyway, Veedback doesn't seem to have these problems, probably because<BR>
it is primarily a commercial venture, and not trying to (or pretending<BR>
to try to) change the world.  Like concerts in contemporary times, a<BR>
Veedback performance is a professionally-orchestrated spectacle.  It's<BR>
not anything like the Concert for Tanoose (which becomes more slick and<BR>
professional every year).<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1982 19:25:16 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: independent Terran invention of jump drive? sure<BR>
<BR>
> From: Garry Ward <Garry.E.Ward@worldnet.att.net><BR>
> Subject: Re: independent Terran invention of jump drive? sure<BR>
> <BR>
> At 08:43 PM 12/15/99 -0600, you wrote:<BR>
> >>Have the Templars approved this guy?  What's his<BR>
> >>security clearance?  He obviously knows too much.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >He's being dealt with.  Can you say recruit or die?<BR>
> <BR>
> Too stubborn to die.<BR>
> Too independent to recruit.<BR>
> Kibitz as a $%$#^% please :)<BR>
> Brake as the mood strikes.<BR>
<BR>
> From: Garry Ward <Garry.E.Ward@worldnet.att.net><BR>
<BR>
> >for him.  I hope he gets the secret handshake down<BR>
> >easily.<BR>
> <BR>
> Now, in the secret handshake, which finger is extended??:)<BR>
<BR>
Excellent.  You've chosen to recruit him without his even being aware of<BR>
it.  He really believes that he is still his pre-Templar self, and will<BR>
conduct himself in every way as if nothing has changed.  <BR>
<BR>
I think he's going to make an excellent addition to the order.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 18 Dec 1982 00:30:43 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: (Way OT and possible Flamebait)<BR>
<BR>
> From: Kyle Schuant <kyle3054@yahoo.com><BR>
<BR>
> God only knows how we manage not to be awash in crime,<BR>
> with brilliant cops like these running around.<BR>
<BR>
Don't overestimate the intellectual capacity of the criminal class.  The<BR>
criminal masterminds of literature are few and far between in real<BR>
life.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 18 Dec 1982 00:35:56 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: re:  Grunts and their food<BR>
<BR>
> From: Kyle Schuant <kyle3054@yahoo.com><BR>
<BR>
> ObTrav: will 3I grunts still complain about their<BR>
> food, and will field rations still bind them up?<BR>
<BR>
This is a truly ancient tradition that will no doubt be maintained well<BR>
into the far future.  Boarding school (of any level) students will also<BR>
participate.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 18 Dec 1982 00:42:35 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Silly Traveller<BR>
<BR>
> From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
<BR>
> Ok, with *that* description I remember it. I agree, it was *just* the<BR>
> serial number.<BR>
> <BR>
> Which means it was discovered when the warehouse changed hands and a<BR>
> *complete* inventory was done. Here's a crate with an unreadable serial<BR>
> number. And the list of items has one item not checked off. <BR>
<BR>
And just when will the United States government entity in charge of that<BR>
facility do a *complete* inventory?  <BR>
<BR>
It probably does a periodic audit, but a complete inventory will only<BR>
take place if it's found necessary to go to the trouble and expense,<BR>
like if evidence of pilfering or other misappropriation has occurred<BR>
(like the Smithsonian's National Gallery of Art found a few years ago).<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1514<BR>
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